3 DAYS of HILLSONG CONFERENCE!!
the conference begins
conference cheeky boy`s..
conference huggsss..
conference song
conference crowd
conference girls
posted by vero at 3:20 AM
Thursday, September 28, 2006
conference girls conference girls 
28 Comments:
love the pics vero.............:)
wow what can I say about conference? challenging siiiiii :)
The passion of darlene and our leaders to reach the lost and hurting was just so impacting..........so much to take in, apply, learn, grow...........it's also time to pull our socks up aswell siiiii............
Love that we're on this journey together girl.............
love moni xxxxx
Mon Oct 02, 04:04:00 AM
yessssssssssss...time to put into pratice what we ve heard and saw....wooohooo..God is great....
indeed it was challenging..darlene was excellent ..the girl should preach more....and christine was............no word....." AND YOU WILL"...ohhh this meassage was ssoooo true and powerfullllllllllll....
Mon Oct 02, 04:13:00 AM
Hello Veronique and Monica,
My name is Arnesto Guavara.Me and my wife Nieves are in full time service for the Lord.We are mainly based in and around Spain,Morroco and just since the beginning of 2006 Gibraltar but we also go to Cincinatti in the States and El Salvador,occasionally to our home South American countries,Argentina,Brazil,Ecuador,Columbia as their is a need.
I want to challenge you:
Luke 24
"47": And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
Galations 1
"8": But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. Strong words used here eh.
The result if you preach another gospel:
Isaiah 29
"13": Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men:
Revelation 3
15": I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
"16": So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
Matthew 3
"10": And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire
If you put broccoli infront of a kid with lovely cheese source,he will gladly eat it up as I found with my tiny tot Hosea :).But take off the cheese source and he wants nothing to do with the broccoli as it doesn't taste too good.He won't hear oh its good for you son.The part that tastes good is actually the cheese source, but the part that does good for your body is actually the broccoli.Many people are enjoying the cheese(The lights,music,action,women/men) more than they actually love God and His word(The brocolli,which is actually the part that is good for you.
Also look in Ephesians how a husband should love his wife as Jesus loves the church.Now if my wife brushes her hair,washes her face and looks GREAT!! then we go to sleep and wake up and her face is all puffed up and her hair out of place,If I didn't love her I'd run a mile.I married Nieves because of who she is though and not how she looks and that love sustains our relationship.The same goes with Christianity.If you preach a man centered gospel of prosperity, the carrot that you dangle infront of them is actually what the desire of people will be rather than God.
I was at the Saturday session of the Hillsong Europe conference where I heard Brian Houston,Christine Cane and Darlene Czech.None of them emphasized righteousness,holiness,reverant Godly fear.None of them illustrated the DEEP DEEP love of Jesus' death on the cross.My wife and I have setup 20 charities all over the world(Not that im boasting)and we love to help out the empoveraged but we realize that even though they are poor and that its important to fullfill their physical needs, they are still people and no man comes to the Father God but by the Son,Jesus.These people need salvation more than anything.We as Christians need to be setting up centers which inspire Godly living and God-centered lives and reliance on God for everything.That needs to be the center of their affection more than the resources you are supplying them with or the education or anything.I don't want to seem harsh here but I could have gone to a Tony Robbins motivational speech or a Jim Rohn pep talk on life and saved myself £100.These guys mention God too and prosperity so why do I then need to go to a church gathering.My answer, to worship God in spirit and in truth and to give to God more than I receive.
I have heard so much about you 2 Veronique and Monica, from my dear brother in Christ,Craig who cannot give you enough praises for your passion and love for Christ and for reaching the lost.He has told me that you said that if all the spiritual left then who would be there to help those who are craving the things of the world more than spiritual things in Hillsong church.Fellowshipping with them and embracing their teaching is not the way to do it though.
Galations 6
1: Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.
Ephesians 5
11: And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
A hypothetical situation for you:
If you are against hypnotism and you make it your mission to stop hypnotism,do you then go in to a hypnotist to try and stop his practice and get hypnotized? No you wouldn't because you would then be contradicting the very thing you are standing for and probably get hypnotized into embracing the practise,in your case,the truth of the gospel that God is a God of wrath and a God to be feared and revered which emphasizes His great love towards us in sending His only Son Jesus which then invokes love in us to worship Him and adore Him every day of our life.So what you would do is still befriend lets say the patients that go in to the hypnotist and try and show them with your evidence that hypnotism is a bad practice,with proof and evidence that you have.In our situation, washing with the word of God. Veronique we have been praying for your family in our prayer group for Zacca(correct me if im wrong)and your mum,dad and other family, then Craig also asked us to pray for for Tamara,Sean,Dana+sister,George,
Brian and his wife and kids and Monica's mom.I have a very personal question for you both.Lets say your parents came to London, would you have them sit under a man centered gospel, have them acknowledge Jesus but not repent of their sins and be truly born again in the spirit and be like those who honour him with their lips but their hearts are far from Him.The bible says that even the devils acknowledge God.Acknowledging him is one thing but being born again is another.I know for example a lot of the Polish guys are now coming to 'salvation' and as you know they come from mostly catholic backgrounds, so now they think that they can just acknowledge Jesus and still go casually to church on and off and they should be ok.Oh no!!!
Romans 10
"10": For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
So do you want temporary,short-lived pleasure of seeing people making 'decisions' week after week or do you desire after what is permanent and genuine?
Remember you guys who know the truth will be held accountable one day on judgement day.The bible says of whom much is asked,much is given.
Read Matthew 7 and also Galations 1 for yourselves.I bless you both and greet you in the wonderful name of our Savious Jesus Christ.I challenge you to stand up and walk worthy of the calling wherewith you have been called.
Ephesians 4
"1": I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called
Proverbs28
1: The wicked flee when no man pursueth: but the righteous are bold as a lion.
Be bold you 2,don't be scared to speak up and especially don't be scared to be a living testimony.Its hard yes but the love of Christ is the drive and if we endure, we will enherit a crown of life.
God bless you both and give you grace and boldness,
Arnesto (In Cincinatti)
Tue Oct 03, 05:13:00 AM
hello arnesto,
quote:
I was at the Saturday session of the Hillsong Europe conference where I heard Brian Houston,Christine Cane and Darlene Czech.None of them emphasized righteousness,holiness,reverant Godly fear.None of them illustrated the DEEP DEEP love of Jesus' death on the cross......................................These people need salvation more than anything.
its a shame cause I do remenber brian etc.. insisting of the fact we are to relieve their physical pain (the poors) and most importantly to bring them the good news of salvation..I rmeneber that clearly cause I was waiting for them to hilight that important fact....
God bless
vero
Tue Oct 03, 05:42:00 AM
Arnesto,
Thank you for your words. I can see much of your information has been given to you by craig and therefore I can assume from what i do know of him ( and I am not meaning this in a derogatory way but by the opinions I know he has. I know he truly loves the Lord.), that it is tainted by his opinion. He also believes another gospel is preached and all other comments that you made. For a while I also had started to be affected by such opinions of some people who were around me at the beginning of the year, but i had to repent of the criticism and judgement I had also passed myself.
To be honest, I am amazed about the astounding assumptions you have made about my church - and was this concluded in just one night at hillsong conference. This is my family and therefore the only reason why I have answered to your message. I have of late, kept myself away from such opinions.
Our church's mission is to reach the lost and to also be all that God has called us to be. The is THE church's mission, that is, OUR goal in life!However, it is a shame many do not see beyond what they say is 'success' and the fact that it is a prospering church. We are well aware that such prosperity means nothing if there is no harvest of souls saved. We must have been in a different conference as I was there and only heard and saw a heart to reach the lost and hurting and to live lives that bring glory to our amazing God. (btw, the anthony robbins conference just across the hall would have cost you a cool £800 for the minimum priced ticket, since you mentioned the motivational speeches)
The word of God is clear, the Lord knows those that are His. Futhermore, holiness is perfected in the fear of the Lord.
This is all I will conclude regarding your message to me and the many assumptions you have made about my church and church family.
Our commission as followers of Jesus Christ is the same one - to go out and preach the gospel and make disciples of the nations. I therefore do not see why the division. I will not make any further comment on this subject but just pray that this kind of assumption and division will come to an end, as Jesus is clear in John 17 that we are to be in unity.
However, i always welcome being challenged in my walk with the Lord so I do thank you for that.
I pray you will draw even closer to the Lord
xx
Tue Oct 03, 07:27:00 AM
Hi Vero,
Just a little away from what is happening here...have you ever been to a conference and kinda had a theme song..meaning one particular song that was sung again and again in a conference from which God was continually speaking and ministering to people?
Love,
Joel
P.S. - So sorry I've been away from the blogging scene for a long, long time! Will try to be more regular!
Tue Oct 03, 11:24:00 AM
salut joelllll..i missed you ...i must say that I am not myself as constant than I used to be in th eprevious blog....so we r even..lol...
but it is soooo good to have u back....you are such an inspiring input in the blogging scene...
the song thing...I know exclty what u mean ,I keep singing that song that we sang at the conference-i dont really like the song ...buti keep singing it......
it says "jesus we are living for your name,we ll never be ashamed of you .....lalalalala"
it s amzing how relevant it s to my spiritual walk right now...
cause I have a burning desire to tell people abt Jesus...but in the same time ...I lack a bit of boldness......
Wed Oct 04, 12:46:00 AM
yeah it was nice... JUST being in christian atmosphere for few days...is enough to make me happy....
Wed Oct 04, 03:23:00 AM
Hello Monica and Veronique,
Its September 10th 2001, you have 24 hours to preach the gospel to those in the world trade centre, knowing that they were going to die.What would you tell them?
God has a wonderful plan for your life,just accept Jesus and you can have this wonderful life?
No you would not,you'd have to change your message wouldn't you?
The same with every soul perishing today.
Hebrews 9
"27": And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
Any of us could die at any second and we will die,thats for sure.
So as with the world trade centre scenario, you know people ae perishing,daily!!!So are you going to tell them God has a wonderful plan for your life?knowing that they were dying in their sins?
Colossions 4
"5": Walk in wisdom toward them that are without, redeeming the time.
Romans 13
"11": And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
James 4
"14": Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away.
2Peter2
"3": And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.
2Peter2
"13": And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
The unsaved are feasting with you and you, thinking they are saved and you condone this?
I just want to make it clear that Craig is an amazing man of God who loves people and has a heart to see people truly saved.He has not tanted my opinion in any way as you say.I know Brian Houston personally,I have attended Hillsong Conference in Sydney and also the normal Hillsong serices,I have tracked the ministry of these men very closely for a long time and I assure you that my thoughts are not based on one Saturday evening in London.Craig has also told me about who I call 'Tension and Shady', people the likes of whom really irritate me because they scare genuine people like you off with their ministry.No I don't stand for legalism but yes I do stand for sound doctrine at all costs.Veronique I heard Brian Houston speak about salvation yes, but remember the unsaved don't know Jesus or about spiritual things, we need to explain it to them.Not the gospel according to Brian Houston etc. The gospel according to the writers in the bible.
Regardless,my opinion or Craigs or anyone else's doesn' matter opinion.The word of God is clear and plain and true and we cannot take its words lightly.All scripture is given by inspiration of God and friendship of the world is enmity with God.I challenge you Monica and Veronique and all readers, critisism is one thing but the word of God is another.You have to draw the fine line between legalism and fundamentals yes,but this is why the bible says study to show thyself approved,a workman,'RIGHTLY' dividing the word of truth.
You know this is very ironic because you Veronique are the one that Craig tells me were the spark God used to get this fire burning in him with the conversation you had about whether someone could lose their salvation.I don't believe 1 can lose his salvation,however the question of whether a person is really saved in the first place is the important thing.Like you said Monica, the Lord knows who are His yes, but the Lord will also not hold those who hold the truth in their hearts and keep it to themselves blameless.
1Peter4
17: For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
If you truly love those people at Hillsong, set their affections agaze on Jesus,righteousness,holiness. No drunkards,adulterers,blasphemers.
muderers,thieves will enter the kingdom of God.Thats not what me or Craig or anyone else are saying, its what the word of God says.
You know Abraham said that truly this is a place of terror when referring to the house of God.God is there in every service, so we should come to him in reverance and fear.Read in Exodus how God repented to Moses as He wanted to wipe out the children of Israel.
Jonah 3
"10": And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.
God is the same yesteday,today and forever.The bible says that he is no respector of persons.
God bless you 2
Wed Oct 04, 06:47:00 AM
Yes Vero...its amazing how some songs that you never really liked can grow on you because the Holy Spirit can and wants to deal with you through that song!
Wed Oct 04, 08:18:00 AM
exctly i found myself singing that song..and wondering why i was humming it..then i thought of the words..and realised that God was right on target...
Wed Oct 04, 09:19:00 AM
It was an amazing song indeed and it really impacted me too but I wept,I didn't cry I wept for all the souls in there because they didn't know what it really meant,the significance of it.
Deut4:24: For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous God.
Deut 9v3: Understand therefore this day, that the LORD thy God is he which goeth over before thee; as a consuming fire he shall destroy them, and he shall bring them down before thy face: so shalt thou drive them out, and destroy them quickly, as the LORD hath said unto thee.
2COR5
11: Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.
Col3v6: For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
Rom1v18: For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness
Rom 9v22: What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
John3v36: He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
Ezekiel22v31: Therefore have I poured out mine indignation upon them; I have consumed them with the fire of my wrath: their own way have I recompensed upon their heads, saith the Lord GOD.
Hebrews10v30: For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31: It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
Deut 31v17: Then my anger shall be kindled against them in that day, and I will forsake them, and I will hide my face from them, and they shall be devoured, and many evils and troubles shall befall them; so that they will say in that day. Are not these evils come upon us, because our God is not among us?
18: And I will surely hide my face in that day for all the evils which they shall have wrought, in that they are turned unto other gods.
2COR 7 1: Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.
There you go, no opinion from me whatsoever, just the word of God.
I say this not to condemn any1 at Hillsong or with the goal of showing up pastors but I say this out of love as I can see that it is definitely a different gospel than the bible that is being preached.
1Thes2vs5
"5": For neither at any time used we flattering words, as ye know, nor a cloke of covetousness; God is witness:
Jesus never ever used flattering words.I heard 1 lady saying that we have to introduce Jesus to the 20th century,I aggree with that, but not by changing the word of God and creating an idol, a GOd that we are comfortable with.The bible says that Godly fear worketh repentance.
The God of the bible and the God described in the sermons that I heard at Hillsong are 2 different people.An idol has been created, a God people can be comfortable, a God that is your friend and who will make everything better.If you tell someone accept Jesus and your life will change for the better.Then they accept Him, their family is killed in a car crash,they lose their job ......They would fall away because they have no root in themself and they've been lied to as they were promised paradise on earth.Nowhere in the bible does God promise this,but he does promise paradise beyond this earth if we crucify the flesh and dispise all youthful lusts.
Matt 13v
"21": Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
Monica you have nothing to repent for because you tried to rebuke and reprove your friends in love,from what Craig tells me, you did it out of a pure heart.There is a difference between righteousness and self righteousness.
Read 2Corinthians7
8: For though I made you sorry with a letter, I do not repent, though I did repent: for I perceive that the same epistle hath made you sorry, though it were but for a season.
9: Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.
10: For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
11: For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
The apostle Paul didn't repent because he knew that in the long run the fruits of his labour would be rejoicing, seeing people truly born again.
The bible says that we should put on Jesus.Many are acknowledging Jesus but thats like acknowledging that a rain jacket will shelter you from the rain and then not actually putting on the rain jacket, so you still get wet.The same with many at Hillsong, they are acknowledging Jesus but are then still living lives of sin because they don't know why Jesus came.
I understand that you had a bad experience Monica with people getting legalistic , look what 1Timothy1 says:
4: Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.
5: Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:
6: From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
7: Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.
I understand that Tension and Shady said that you shouldn't study too much but just read and the Holy Spirit would guide you.Thats just flippant if you ask me and that explains why they brought accross this legalistic viewpoint when the bible says study to show thyself approved.Please don't make the mistake MANY people have made to just sweep the word of God under the carpet and create a God that you are comfortable with.Your families and friends and others are relying on you.I'm not talking about hellfire preaching which I think does more harm than good but im talking about instructing people gently with the word of God.
Joel, Veronique,Monica and other readers I emplore you with tears in my eyes.People are dying,the wrath of God is on their heads,People in the very services at church you attend who don't understand anything about holiness,righteousness and Godly fear.People need to put on Jesus who is the righteousness that they need on judgement day.Do you all have a heart? Then don't love like the world loves:
Jude1v"23": And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.
Be bold like the apostle Paul and look long term (True repentance,righteousness,holiness) and not short term, acknowledement of Jesus and no true repentance.
God Bless,
Arnesto
Fri Oct 06, 05:43:00 AM
Hey guys watch this video:
The gospel according to Oprah:
http://www.wfial.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=resources.oprah&badUrl=http://www.wfial.org:80/resources/oprah
God bless you all
Love,Nieves
Fri Oct 06, 05:48:00 AM
thanks nieves...as u can see ive already blogg your link....nice input..
v
Fri Oct 06, 05:57:00 AM
Arnesto and craig........
Fight the right battles.
moni x
Mon Oct 09, 03:12:00 AM
Why do I need to confess faith in Jesus Christ?
Because He will make my life better here on earth?
or because the wrath of God abides upon the children of disobedience.
For all have sinned and come short of the Glory of God and the wages of sin is death)
(Eph 5v6 and Col 3v6;Rom3v23 and Rom6v23)
So how do I escape this wrath of God to come?
Mar 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
What do we need to repent from?
Sin
How do we know what sin is?
Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
If we don't tell people what sin is and that they are sinners and have the anger of God abiding upon them, HOW CAN THEY POSSIBLY REPENT?
2Co 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
The bible says that God has placed His law on the hearts of every man/woman.For by the law is the knowledge of sin.When we see that we are sinners in the hands of a Holy,Powerful God then we get the fear of God and flee to Jesus Christ who is the ONLY WAY, THE ONLY TRUTH ,THE ONLY LIFE.
Col 3:10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
Hillsong does not preach the gospel of the bible!!!!!!!!!!!!
The law is not preached,therefore there is no knowledge of sin,therefore there is no repentance,therefore there is an acknowledgment of God but NO CHANGE whatsoever,THEREFORE THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF FALSE CONVERTS!!!.People have been blinded into thinking that they can go on the way they did before as long as they acknowledge Jesus Christ,they will get to heaven.
OH NO!!!!!!!!!! This is a deception of the worst kind by the devil himself.
Veronique I know you say Brian Houston spoke about salvation at the conference, but He failed to mention what people need to be saved from.THEIR SIN.He also failed to mention Repentance from sin.Its like an electronic toothbrush we gave a kid in Africa once.He just put the toothpaste on and brushed his teeth as usual, not pushing on the power button.This is exactly what is happening at Hillsong.Tons of activity and numbers but no Godly fear and no POWER.Monica RE your comment: what is the definition of a prosperous church? Its a church where people are hungering and thursting after righteousness,after the word of God and a church that is seeking to please God and that dispises even the garment stained with sin according to the word of God.If your church had 5000 people like that I would be the first 1 to shut my mouth and get down on my knees and say hallelujah, and give thanks to God.This is not the case though and you guys know this.The prosperity of Hillsong(the organisation) is of more importance than what God wants.
The law,repentance,the wrath of God and HELL is not preached at Hillsong.SO HOW CAN PEOPLE POSSIBLY FEAR GOD?I aggree with Arnesto, This is definitely a different gospel that is being preached and the consequences are there for the world to see and it does.I believe Hillsong is going to TV soon?.I will be honest with you and say that I dread the day.Another superchurch like the 1 here in Canada,more thousands of false converts that will say Lord Lord but I proclaimed your name.
'For a while I also had started to be affected by such opinions of some people who were around me at the beginning of the year, but i had to repent of the criticism and judgement I had also passed myself.' These are not the opinions of people Monica, it is what the word of God says.Fornication,drunkedness,reviling,idolotary,lies,adultery and more will keep a soul out of heaven according to the word of God and not according to peoples opinions as you say.If you don't tell these people the truth, you hate them.Tell them the truth, you love them.This is love.Have a rethink about Hillsong's mission and make up your own mind and don't be lead by the words of men.
My prayers are with you all
Fri Oct 20, 03:53:00 AM
Hi Tom's sister Alicia here
I left Hillsong in 2005 because:
Hillsongs methods are very very clear if you're even remotely familiar with the bible.Just read the banner on the big screen infront of the Dominion Theatre:
Mat 5:13 Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.
Mat 5:14 Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.
Mat 5:15 Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.
Mat 5:16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.
It was a conscious decision by the leaders of Hillsong to leave out the preceding and following verses which put this statement in its correct context and give us the instruction that is so obviously lacking in Hillsong:
Mat 5:1 And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him:
Mat 5:2 And he opened his mouth, and taught them, saying,
Mat 5:3 Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:4 Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
Mat 5:5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
Mat 5:6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
Mat 5:7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
Mat 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
Mat 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
Mat 5:10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
Mat 5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.
And the verses following:
Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Mat 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
Mat 5:23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;
Mat 5:24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
Mat 5:25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.
Mat 5:26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.
Mat 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Mat 5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Mat 5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Mat 5:31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
Mat 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
Mat 5:33 Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths:
Mat 5:34 But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne:
Mat 5:35 Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King.
Mat 5:36 Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black.
Mat 5:37 But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.
Mat 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
Mat 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
Mat 5:40 And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also.
Mat 5:41 And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.
Mat 5:42 Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.
Mat 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Mat 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
Mat 5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
Its definitely a different gospel being preached:
1Th 2:5 For neither at any time used we flattering words, as ye know, nor a cloke of covetousness; God is witness:
My goal uplift and build up people in the faith,not to bring any down.God is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to the knowledge of salvation.
Fri Oct 20, 04:10:00 AM
I was meditating on these verses this morning then read your comments on here:
Isa 33:6 And wisdom and knowledge shall be the stability of thy times, and strength of salvation: the fear of the LORD is his treasure.
2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
I aggree with Monica, we need to be careful that we do not become critical.However we also need to be tough as nails when it comes to defending our faith and especially cannot water down the gospel of Jesus Christ.Its a balance that needs to be prayerfully struck.Speaking the truth in love.
Fri Oct 20, 04:23:00 AM
I invite you all to come to hear Joseph Prince at the Dominion - 10.30, 1.30 and 5pm.
You're very welcome.
A message from his website. Enjoy!
The Holy Spirit — Jesus Christ Unlimited
Unfortunately, some Christians have the attitude that they would rather have Jesus in person rather than the Holy Spirit. But do you know what Jesus said on the night of the Passover?
John 16:7
7Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you.
Notice that Jesus said that it is to our advantage that He went away so that the Holy Spirit could come. And that is the truth! But some of us don’t believe that it is to our advantage that we have the Holy Spirit instead of Jesus. Some of us don’t see the Holy Spirit as someone precious.
Do you know that Jesus on earth could only be at one place at one time? But the Holy Spirit is Jesus Christ unlimited! He is omnipresent! He can be in you and in me. He dwells in the heart of every believer. That is why it is to our advantage that Jesus went away!
All Word And All Spirit
It is also sad to know that there are some Christians who think that they don’t need the Holy Spirit because all they need is the Bible. Then, there are some Christians who think they don’t need the Bible because they have the Holy Spirit to lead them.
Now, the Bible is written by the Holy Spirit. It is breathed by Him. So we need both the Bible and the Holy Spirit. The Bible makes the leading of the Spirit sure, stable and secure. The Bible is like the railroad track, while the Spirit is like the power that drives the engine of the train. Without the Bible, you lack direction, and without the Spirit, you lack power.
So if you have all Word and no Spirit, you dry up. If you have all Spirit and no Word, you blow up. But when you have all Word and all Spirit, you grow up! That is why it is important that we have both the Bible and the Holy Spirit in our lives. The Bible tells you what God will do for you, but the Holy Spirit tells you how it will be done in your life. In fact, the Holy Spirit Himself will lead you and guide you into all truth.
How The Holy Spirit Leads Us
Today, the way the Holy Spirit leads you is with peace and joy. Romans 14:17 says that “the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit”.
When you depend on your own thinking and intelligence to solve your problems, you get into more fear and worry. But when you are led by the Holy Spirit, He always leads you out of your bondage, stress and worry, and into peace and joy.
You might ask, “But what if I am not in peace and joy?”
My friend, in Isaiah 28:12, the Bible says that praying in the Spirit is the rest and the refreshing. So I would like to encourage you to pray more in the Spirit. The more you do so, the more you will be at rest and refreshed. And the more you will flow with and be led by the peace and joy of the Holy Spirit.
The Key To Receiving
Now, let me show you how the Holy Spirit causes us to receive the blessings of God.
In the Old Testament, Isaiah 53 talks about how Jesus suffered to purchase every blessing for us with His blood, and Isaiah 54 goes on to talk about all the blessings that flow from what Jesus did. But Isaiah 55 tells us what to do.
Isaiah 55:2–3
2... Listen carefully to Me, and eat what is good, and let your soul delight itself in abundance. 3Incline your ear, and come to Me. Hear, and your soul shall live; and I will make an everlasting covenant with you — the sure mercies of David.
Notice that words like “listen carefully”, “incline your ear” and “hear” appear in this passage. They all mean the same thing. So the key to receiving all the blessings that Jesus died to give you is to listen to God’s Word.
Do you know what happens when God’s Word goes forth?
Isaiah 55:10–11
10For as the rain comes down, and the snow from heaven, and do not return there, but water the earth, and make it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower and bread to the eater, 11So shall My word be that goes forth from My mouth; It shall not return to Me void, but it shall accomplish what I please, and it shall prosper in the thing for which I sent it.
Now, in the Bible, rain is a picture of both God’s Word and the Holy Spirit. So when God’s Word powered by the Spirit rains down on you, get ready for prosperity because God’s Word will always prosper in the thing for which it was sent! Whatever you need in your life — from the beginning (seed) to the end (bread) — the Word of God will provide for you. (Isaiah 55:10)
Go Out With Joy And Be Led Out With Peace
The beautiful result of being led by the Holy Spirit is this:
Isaiah 55:12–13
12”For you shall go out with joy, and be led out with peace; the mountains and the hills shall break forth into singing before you, and all the trees of the field shall clap their hands. 13Instead of the thorn shall come up the cypress tree, and instead of the brier shall come up the myrtle tree; and it shall be to the Lord for a name, for an everlasting sign that shall not be cut off.”
When you go forth with peace and joy, you are a blessing everywhere you go. Even the works of creation like the mountains, hills and trees will rejoice and applaud when you pass by! And trees that bring forth thorns (which speaks of the curse) will blossom into trees in Israel that represent blessings — the cypress and myrtle trees!
Copyright © 2006 New Creation Church
Fri Oct 20, 04:52:00 AM
I have a question for anonymous.IF you were the last truly born again Christian on earth,you were poor,never have much money and you wanted to take the gospel of Jesus to the world.All you had is a bible, a little job to get by and not much resources at your disposal.No bands,drums,lights,cameras,nothing.DO you believe that the word of God can still work and use you mightily to save souls? I say a clear YES!!!!!! and you know why?
Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
All that you need to do is preach the word, exactly as it is in the bible.God does not need you to mend his words or sugarcoat it.
2Co 10:4 (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)
Our minced words neutralize the power of Gods word and we quench the Holy Spirit
All God needs for his word to save souls is for His word to go out.The Holy SPirit will do the convicting and saving.
Heres a question that you don't have to answer to me,but answer for yourself.Do you believe in the power of the Holy Spirit?
Salvation is a miracle wrought by God himself,that sees a man repent of his sins and become a new creation.
1Co 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
May Gods rest and peace and mainfold wisdom be breathed upon you anonymous and I will pray that you will not conform like the rest of the sheep to the precepts of Men
Tom
Sun Oct 22, 02:48:00 AM
Spurgeon :
“Here in the cross is where every enemy of joy is overcome: divine wrath, as he becomes a curse for us; real guilt, as he becomes forgiveness for us; lawbreaking, as he becomes righteousness for us; estrangement from God, as he becomes reconciliation for us; slavery to Satan, as he becomes redemption for us; bondage to sin, as he becomes liberation for us; pangs of conscience, as he becomes cleansing for us; death, as he becomes the resurrection for us; hell, as he becomes eternal life for us.”
Mon Oct 23, 07:33:00 AM
Thats beautiful anonymous!!!!
It has to be considered carefully though:
1John2
1: My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2: And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
3: And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4: He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5: But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
6: He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.
7: Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.
8: Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.
9: He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.
10: He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.
11: But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.
12: I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.
13: I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I write unto you, young men, because ye have overcome the wicked one. I write unto you, little children, because ye have known the Father.
14: I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I have written unto you, young men, because ye are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and ye have overcome the wicked one.
15: Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
16: For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
17: And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.
18: Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
19: They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.
20: But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.
21: I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
22: Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
23: Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.
24: Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father.
25: And this is the promise that he hath promised us, even eternal life.
26: These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you.
27: But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
28: And now, little children, abide in him; that, when he shall appear, we may have confidence, and not be ashamed before him at his coming.
29: If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.
I hope though that some don't take your comment in the wrong way Anonymous and think that because Christ died, we can now do what we want as long as we confess and believe in Him.You cannot sin and then say,now don't look to me who is a sinner,look to Jesus.If you truly know Jesus,it is in your nature not to sin or to be burdened when you do.
Tue Oct 24, 05:42:00 AM
1 Corinthians 15:56-57
56The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
57But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ
This is the reason why you are so overtly concerned with sin and assume such a comment means people will choose to live as they want. You are a preacher of the law, and the strength of sin is the law.
Judgement is constantly on your lips.
You need the blood of Jesus to wash you too, otherwise you are trying to be righteous in your own strength (also works of the flesh, of your own strength) and are therefore assuming that the cross of Christ was not sufficient as the one time sacrifice for our sin.
You also talk like you don't sin and don't need God's grace and 1 John says clearly that those who say they have no sin is a liar.
Rest in the grace of God. It is heartbreaking to see that you have not understood the love of God for you - it is conditional in your eyes and you therefore do not believe that one is righteous even when one falls, you don't believe that the blood of Jesus has washed you. That is because to you, Jesus is not your righteousness as you are busy trying to be righteous on your own. Jesus IS your righteousness.
I pray you will be able to rest and trust in the finished work of the cross of Jesus Christ!
Tue Oct 24, 06:51:00 AM
Our Righteousness in Christ
Romans 4
1 What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh?
2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God.
3 For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”
4 Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.
5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness,
6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works:
7 “ Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven,
And whose sins are covered;
8 Blessed is the man to whom the LORD shall not impute sin.”
9 Does this blessedness then come upon the circumcised only, or upon the uncircumcised also? For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness.
10 How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised.
11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also, 12 and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but who also walk in the steps of the faith which our father Abraham had while still uncircumcised.
13 For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.
14 For if those who are of the law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise made of no effect,
15 because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression.
16 Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all
17 (as it is written, “I have made you a father of many nations”[d]) in the presence of Him whom he believed—God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did;
18 who, contrary to hope, in hope believed, so that he became the father of many nations, according to what was spoken, “So shall your descendants be.”
19 And not being weak in faith, he did not consider his own body, already dead (since he was about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb.
20 He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God,
21 and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform.
22 And therefore “it was accounted to him for righteousness.”
23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him,
24 but also for us. It shall be imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead,
25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification.
Read the book of James for those who counteract this passage saying that faith without works is dead. The 'works' it refers to here is not 'works towards holiness and righteousness' as under the new covenant there is no such thing, your own righteousness is like filthy rags to the Lord. Only Jesus imparts righteousness.
See James 2 -
1 My brethren, do not hold the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with partiality
continue reading all of it - -
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,”you do well; 9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. 11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.”Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.
13 For judgment is without mercy to the one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment
Do not be foolish to put yourself under any part of the law in the old testament, as if you do not keep even one part then you are condemned as a transgressor of the whole law, it cannot be separated into segments. It is one whole law.
Instead, we will be judged by the law of liberty. Praise God!
Concerning the works without which faith is dead see below -
14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food,
16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
18 But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.
19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble!
20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar?
22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect?
23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”And he was called the friend of God.
24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
If repentance should first be preached, how was a harlot like Rahab, justified and considered righteous when it is not recorded that she was asked first to repent of her sin?
Her 'works' was that she believed God would save her from the coming judgement on her town, that her household and family would be spared if she hang the red core outside her window (red - like the blood of Jesus, She was covered). The other works, are do not be hypocritical and say you love your brother but you do not feed or clothe them when they are in need. Part of the royal law under the new testament it says is to love your neighbour as yourself. Nowhere, are these 'works' refered to as works 'towards holiness or righhteousness'. You either believe that Jesus makes you righteous or you don't and so then you spend the rest of your life earning His love. This does not please the Father.
Let go of trying to earn your righteousness and inheritance in Christ and live in peace. Rest in His finished work. God loves you and wants you to be free from this condemnation and struggle you have put yourself under.
Grace be with you.
Wed Oct 25, 03:07:00 AM
Hello Anonymous,
I’ll be the first to admit that I am not perfect and don’t want to pretend that I am.I count it all joy that a Holy,Righteous God looked upon a guilty imperfect sinner like me and only by His AMAZING Grace saw it fit to humble Himself and become a man,Jesus Christ and lay down His life and suffer on a cross and bleed for me,paying the price to overlook all my sins,even though He is a Holy God who hates sin..Like you well said, the blood of Jesus has covered all my imperfection and only faith in Jesus has saved me and no works that I done could and nothing I do going forward could make me more saved.Death hath no sting because true faith in Jesus Christ leads to everlasting life.When I survey the wondress cross on which the King of Glory died,my richest gain I count but loss and poor contempt on all my pride.Forbid it Lord that I should boast save in the blood of Christ my Lord, love so amazing so devine,demands MY LIFE,MY SOUL,MY ALL!!!!!!!
I totally get your thought pattern here and I see totally where you’re coming from and am in agreement as far as not being justified by the law.
Gal 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
1Ti 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
Heb 7:19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.
Phi 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
Gal 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
Luk 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Heres is what I have been saying all along though.
A Homosexual comes to you and says ‘ I accepted Jesus Christ as my Lord and Saviour, I Believe in Him and His death on the cross and His resurrection and I’m on my way to heaven.He says this but happily continues in practicing homosexuality.Is he saved?
A guy confesses faith in Jesus Christ,the next day he goes and commits a murder and then just gets down on his knees and says God forgive me in Jesus name,the next day he repeats the same process is he saved?
Someone continually tells lies,willfully,knowing it is wrong.He has confessed faith in Jesus and believes sincerely in the cross and the resurrection and the return.He lies willfully though and is not even bothered inwardly.Is he truly born again?
You have a brother or sister or friend who is practicing premarital sex, with their boyfriend/girlfriend.You witness to him/her and she/he confesses faith in Jesus and genuinely believes in His death on the cross that covers all our sins, is she saved if she continues fornicating?
I have a catholic mother.She acknowledges Jesus but still believes Mary is greater than Jesus and that confession to a priest will blot out her sins(idolotary).Is my mother saved because she believes in Jesus Christ and the cross?
1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
1Ti 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
1Ti 1:10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
Gal 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
Gal 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.
1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
Now if we’re realistic here we all sin, but someone who is born of the spirit is overtaken by his conscience and gets on his knees and repents because his new nature is good,he is a new creation in Christ Jesus.
2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
1Jo 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
That was a beautiful illustration you brought out of the scarlett thread of Rahab(faith) that is likened to faith in Christ.I enjoyed that,jogged my memory.
If repentance should first be preached, how was a harlot like Rahab, justified and considered righteous when it is not recorded that she was asked first to repent of her sin?
Her 'works' was that she believed God would save her from the coming judgement on her town, that her household and family would be spared if she hang the red core outside her window (red - like the blood of Jesus, She was covered).
Her faith was that she knew God brought the children of Israel through the red sea and saved them from the hands of the Egyptians,amongst other incidents.She then feared and acknowledged God:
Jos 2:10 For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red sea for you, when ye came out of Egypt; and what ye did unto the two kings of the Amorites, that were on the other side Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom ye utterly destroyed.
Jos 2:11 And as soon as we had heard these things, our hearts did melt, neither did there remain any more courage in any man, because of you: for the LORD your God, he is God in heaven above, and in earth beneath.
Jos 2:12 Now therefore, I pray you, swear unto me by the LORD, since I have shewed you kindness, that ye will also shew kindness unto my father's house, and give me a true token:
Heb 11:31 By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.
Her works were actually a result of her faith.She knew that there was a judgement to come and then took action to save her life and her family’s life by firstly hiding the 2 Hebrew men and then obeying them by hanging the scarlet thread.
Her works
Jam 2:25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
See (Joshua 2v1-22);(Jos 6v17,21-23) for the full account
'The other works, are do not be hypocritical and say you love your brother but you do not feed or clothe them when they are in need. Part of the royal law under the new testament it says is to love your neighbour as yourself. Nowhere, are these 'works' refered to as works 'towards holiness or righhteousness'. You either believe that Jesus makes you righteous or you don't and so then you spend the rest of your life earning His love. This does not please the Father.Let go of trying to earn your righteousness and inheritance in Christ and live in peace. Rest in His finished work. God loves you and wants you to be free from this condemnation and struggle you have put yourself under.'
Do a search in your bible for every reference to the word ‘WORKS’
Here is 1 example:
Rev 3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
Now if what you are saying is right the I can interpret this passage of scripture as follows:
’ I know your works, you sometimes hate your neighbour and sometimes times you don’t’ Or ‘sometimes you feed your brother who is in need and other times you don’t’
It just doesn’t add up does it?
Nowhere, are these 'works' refered to as works 'towards holiness or righhteousness'.>>
Here are the rest of the references to works in the bible for you:
Exo_5:4; Exo_5:13; Exo_23:24; Exo_31:4; Exo_35:32; Num_16:28; Deu_2:7; Deu_3:24; Deu_15:10; Deu_16:15; Jos_24:31; Jdg_2:7; Jdg_2:10; 1Sa_8:8; 1Sa_19:4; 1Ki_7:14; 1Ki_13:11; 2Ki_22:17; 1Ch_16:9; 1Ch_16:12; 1Ch_16:24; 1Ch_28:19; 2Ch_20:37; 2Ch_32:30; 2Ch_34:25; Neh_6:14; Neh_9:35; Job_34:25; Job_37:14; Job_37:16; Psa_8:6; Psa_9:1; Psa_14:1; Psa_17:4; Psa_26:7; Psa_28:5; Psa_33:4; Psa_33:15; Psa_40:5; Psa_46:8; Psa_66:3; Psa_66:5; Psa_71:17; Psa_73:28; Psa_75:1; Psa_77:11; Psa_78:4; Psa_78:7; Psa_78:11; Psa_78:32; Psa_86:8; Psa_92:4; Psa_92:5; Psa_103:22; Psa_104:13; Psa_104:24; Psa_104:31; Psa_105:2; Psa_105:5; Psa_106:13; Psa_106:22; Psa_106:35; Psa_106:39; Psa_107:8; Psa_107:15; Psa_107:21; Psa_107:22; Psa_107:24; Psa_107:31; Psa_111:2; Psa_111:4; Psa_111:6; Psa_111:7; Psa_118:17; Psa_119:27; Psa_138:8; Psa_139:14; Psa_141:4; Psa_143:5; Psa_145:4; Psa_145:5; Psa_145:9; Psa_145:10; Psa_145:17; Pro_7:16; Pro_8:22; Pro_16:3; Pro_24:12; Pro_31:31; Ecc_1:14; Ecc_2:4; Ecc_2:11; Ecc_3:22; Ecc_9:1; Ecc_9:7; Ecc_11:5; Isa_26:12; Isa_29:15; Isa_41:29; Isa_57:12; Isa_59:6; Isa_66:18; Jer_1:16; Jer_7:13; Jer_21:2; Jer_25:6; Jer_25:7; Jer_25:14; Jer_44:8; Jer_48:7; Eze_6:6; Dan_4:37; Dan_9:14; Amo_8:7; Jon_3:10; Mic_6:16; Mat_5:16; Mat_7:22; Mat_11:2; Mat_11:20; Mat_11:21; Mat_11:23; Mat_13:54; Mat_13:58; Mat_14:2; Mat_16:27; Mat_23:3; Mat_23:5; Mar_6:2; Mar_6:14; Luk_10:13; Luk_19:37; Joh_5:20; Joh_5:36; Joh_6:28; Joh_7:3; Joh_7:7; Joh_8:39; Joh_9:3; Joh_9:4; Joh_10:25; Joh_10:32; Joh_10:37; Joh_10:38; Joh_14:10; Joh_14:11; Joh_14:12; Joh_15:24; Act_2:11; Act_7:41; Act_9:36; Act_15:18; Act_26:20; Rom_3:27; Rom_4:2; Rom_4:6; Rom_9:11; Rom_9:32; Rom_11:6; Rom_13:3; Rom_13:12; 2Co_11:15; Gal_2:16; Gal_3:2; Gal_3:5; Gal_3:10; Gal_5:19; Eph_2:9; Eph_2:10; Eph_5:11; Col_1:21; 1Ti_2:10; 1Ti_5:10; 1Ti_5:25; 1Ti_6:18; 2Ti_1:9; 2Ti_3:17; 2Ti_4:14; Tit_1:16; Tit_2:7; Tit_2:14; Tit_3:5; Tit_3:8; Tit_3:14; Heb_1:10; Heb_2:7; Heb_3:9; Heb_4:3; Heb_4:4; Heb_4:10; Heb_6:1; Heb_9:14; Heb_10:24; Jam_2:14; Jam_2:17; Jam_2:18; Jam_2:20; Jam_2:21; Jam_2:22; Jam_2:24; Jam_2:25; Jam_2:26; Jam_3:13; 1Pe_2:12; 2Pe_3:10; 1Jo_3:8; 1Jo_3:12; Rev_2:2; Rev_2:5; Rev_2:9; Rev_2:13; Rev_2:19; Rev_2:23; Rev_2:26; Rev_3:1; Rev_3:2; Rev_3:8; Rev_3:15; Rev_9:20; Rev_14:13; Rev_15:3; Rev_18:6; Rev_20:12; Rev_20:13;
Act 26:20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.
Mat 3:8 Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:
Mat 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
Mat 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
Mar 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
Luk 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
Can you see that the gospel message has a consistency to it that echoes all through the scriptures? And can you also see that God command repentance and that its not optional.
I end with the following :
Gal 5:17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Gal 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
I concur with you, Christ IS my righteousness and ‘I’ cannot earn it, but there are fruits of salvation, a distinct change in me and in every truly born again Christian.
Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
My heart really goes out to you anonymous.This Christian life is 1 bumpy ride, my wife and I have been engaged in this work for 20 years now and there have been so many pitfalls and trials, but God is faithful and He is the ultimate sustainer and if you truly,genuinely keep your eyes fixed on him and don’t for a second blink or listen to the precepts of men, he will be a lamp unto your feet and light unto your path and nothing can harm you.Its really hard for us to appear as people who ‘have nothing but judgement on our lips’ but you need to understand that this is a spiritual battle, not against flesh and blood so sometimes you gotta be tough as nails as you are battling the devil and his angels who have blinded the hearts of men, and look past the actual confrontation with men.
'God loves you and wants you to be free from this condemnation and struggle you have put yourself under.'
2Ti 2:3 Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.
I count it all joy and a privilege to be called a soldier in the name of my Lord.Im not condemned or struggling, im free, i will meet my Jesus soon, what a glorious day that will be.I live for that day and not for the things of this earth which will all pass away.
May God’s richest blessing be upon you
In love,
Arnesto and Nieves Guavara
(PS You have a beautiful heart!!!!!!!!)
Fri Oct 27, 07:55:00 PM
Shut up Arnesto!!!!! I Aggree with anonymous
I am not married and I have an active sexual relationship with my partner.Will this condemn me to hell? No it won't you idiot.
I believe in Jesus and that he died on the cross for me.I go to church as often as I can and I love God and God loves me.I honour my girlfriend and she honours me and we are madly in love.We are committed to one another and maybe will get married some day.Live in peace and don't bind yourself Arnesto,listen to Anonymous.
Mon Oct 30, 01:22:00 AM
I quote:
A Homosexual comes to you and says ‘ I accepted Jesus Christ as my Lord and Saviour, I Believe in Him and His death on the cross and His resurrection and I’m on my way to heaven.He says this but happily continues in practicing homosexuality.Is he saved?
Are you telling me that from the moment you got saved, you have never once lied, had a lustful thought, showed pride, gossiped, the list of sins go on. I have to assume that ofcourse you have because 1 John says clearly that those who say there is no sin in them is a liar - he was not talking to unbelievers here in this passage, he was talking to the believers. In the eyes of God sin is not categorised therefore a lie is not better than sexual immorality, no matter how small, it is still sin in the eyes of God.
Therefore, you also need the grace of God daily, otherwise by your way of thinking you stop being saved the moment you sin. That would therefore also include yourself.
You do not understand the grace of God.
grace always leads to a life of holiness. Those who abuse the grace of God by saying they will live as they choose just because they are loved by God have not understood the grace of God, the great price that was paid by Jesus Christ. They still feel judged and under condemnation and as you saw from scripture, the strength of sin is the law. They don't run to the arms of a loving Father who still loves them. They haven't understood grace and so live a life with God from a distance in fear of judgement. When you know you can come boldly to the throne of grace because of what Jesus did, you do not fear judgement and the closer you are to God the more you will now keep away from things which God has told us to stay away from. It comes almost naturally.
Sounds like a contradiction? No it isn't. A true revelatin of the grace of Jesus Christ, does not result in you treating the cross of no worth. It results in the complete opposite. He who is forgiven much, loves much! However, as we are still human, when we do fall we need not be condemned for we are covered by the blood of Jesus. Read 1 John, 2 John, 3 John.
Part of the verses you used to support your view that believers who fall into sin are not saved was as follows:
1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
To you I say this - Jesus is our righteousness. The Corinthian church was corrupt. They even went to temple prostitutes, yet Paul never ONCE said in the 2 letters to the Corinth church that they were now fallen from grace and not saved. Actually, what did he say to them? He told them 'do you not know that your body IS the temple of the Holy Spirit?' He DID NOT say 'it WAS the temple of the Holy Spirt but because you have sinned, now you are no longer saved or righteous.' No friend, Paul did not tell them that they are now not saved. What did Paul truly say?
1 Corinthians 1:2-9
2Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their's and our's:
3Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.
4I thank my God always on your behalf, for the grace of God which is given you by Jesus Christ;
5That in every thing ye are enriched by him, in all utterance, and in all knowledge;
6Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you:
7So that ye come behind in no gift; waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ:
8Who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord
Also, on Righteousness - still chapter 1
30But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
31That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.
Paul then continues to address them and in chapter 3 even says that they are carnal
3For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
He has yet to say that the corinthians are not saved because they have sinned once being born again. Now am I implying that sin is fine? Keep reading the book - still chap 3
16Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
17If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
18Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.
19For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.
20And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.
21Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are your's;
22Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are your's;
23And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.
Man's wisdom is do good, get good, do bad, get bad. Grace, however, is beyond man's wisdom.
Keep reading: from chapter 4 (read all inbetween)
17For this cause have I sent unto you Timotheus, who is my beloved son, and faithful in the Lord, who shall bring you into remembrance of my ways which be in Christ, as I teach every where in every church.
18Now some are puffed up, as though I would not come to you.
19But I will come to you shortly, if the Lord will, and will know, not the speech of them which are puffed up, but the power.
20For the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power.
21What will ye? shall I come unto you with a rod, or in love, and in the spirit of meekness?
From chapter 6 - earlier on you quoted 1 Corinthians 6:9 BUT you only gave us 1 verse and did not include the very vital verse concerning judgement:see verse 11
9Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
11And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
He then continues to teach them the right way
12All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.
13Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.
In love Paul shows them the way. But he continually reminds them that they are STILL the temple of the Holy Spirit. They are still saved. They just need to be shown the way in love, not judged and told they are not saved, as you seem to have assumed. He continues to teach in love -
18Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
19What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.
When you say a believer who has sinned is not saved just because they fall into sin is completely unscriptural if that person is already a child of God. Even the one that was cast to satan in 1 Corinthians is then told to be admonished as a brother and is not an enemy in 2 Corinth.
Grace is not an excuse for sin, but sin is certainly not more powerful than the blood of Jesus. It does not cancel salvation! there is no such thing! A child of God should not run from God when they sin because they think that God will now reject them, but instead run to the arms of the Father because the blood of Jesus washes you clean. You are righteous by Christ Jesus. God already knew your weaknesses and still sent his Son to die for you that you may be reconciled. You make Christians run from God when you preach the way you do because even someone who doesn't know the bible well will know that Jesus said that if you even think lustful thoughts then you have commited adultary. No-one can keep that - and Jesus knew that well!! It is only by faith in Jesus christ that we are saved! You will find no scripture that says that if as believers we sin ,then we are not saved anymore......You can find one or two and quote them out of context as you did earlier regarding fornicators and drunkards etc, but when those verses are quoted in context, your theology is inaccurate.
May the grace of God be with you.
your verses to support preaching repentance of sin still do not show that we are told to preach that. It shows we need to
Mon Oct 30, 06:07:00 AM
Does God's gift of eternal life require us to DO something?
Once "saved" are we FREE to do whatever we want?
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Does the Bible contradict itself?
Consider the message of Galatians 2:16:
"[T]hat we may be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law shall no flesh be justified (NASB throughout, unless otherwise noted)."
So then---works have nothing to do with salvation. But what about Matthew 19:17:
"[B]ut if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments"?
Or Hebrews 5:9:
"And having been made perfect, He [Jesus] became to all those who obey Him the source of eternal salvation."
So what then--are works a condition for salvation in the latter verses, but are not in Galatians?
First of all, to solve this seeming contradiction, we must realize that justification is not the same thing as salvation. Surprising? Consider Romans 5:9:
"Much more then, having now been justified [past tense] by His blood, we shall be saved [future tense] from the wrath of God through Him."
Justification, meaning the wiping away of all past sins, has already occurred in Christians' lives when we repented and placed our faith in Jesus' sacrifice. By contrast, salvation, meaning having our lives lasting forever because we have bodies made of spirit, has not occurred yet since we have not entered the kingdom of God yet. So Gal. 2:16, which talks about justification, need not conflict with Hebrews 5:9, which talks about salvation.
Of course in some cases the word "saved" does mean the same as "justified." One meaning for the word "saved" is that the death penalty of our sins has been removed by Jesus' sacrifice, which is the same thing as justification. But another meaning is being given eternal life through an immortal spirit body when Jesus comes back, since then we could never die. The word "saved" is applied to Christians in three different tenses in the Bible. In Acts 15:11, it is used in the past tense:
"But we believe that we are saved through the grace of Lord Jesus, in the same way as they also are."
Salvation is a process in I Cor. 1:18 since it is in the present, progressive tense:
"For the word of the cross is to those who are perishing foolishness, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God."
Finally, in a familiar text, it is used in the future tense:
"But the one who endures to the end, he shall be saved" (Matt. 24:13).
Obviously, the Bible uses the word "saved" in several different ways about Christians, or else the Bible would contradict itself!
We can understand salvation a bit better if we define basic Biblical concepts such as "justification," "sanctification," and "glorification."
"Justification" has the basic definition that Christians are given a right standing before God through having all their sins forgiven through faith in Jesus' sacrifice on our behalf.
"Sanctification" is the process by which Christians actually become righteous through developing holy righteous character through the Holy Spirit living in them.
"Glorification" occurs when we enter the kingdom of God and are given a spirit body at the first resurrection when Jesus returns (Phil. 3:20-21; I Cor. 15:49).
Here justification is gained by faith through grace alone, but sanctification involves Christians actually obeying God literally in order for them to be made actually holy. Justification is gained by men and women accepting Jesus' sacrifice by faith, baptism, and repentance (Acts 2:38). "Works" have nothing to do with it here. In contrast, for humans to actually become holy, they must gain the Holy Spirit and then follow its lead in obeying God. Sanctification involves human effort and participation in a way that neither justification nor glorification involve, for the latter two are fundamentally just "done" to humans by God, while the former requires the effort of continually yielding our will to God's will.
Now consider the problems supposedly created by contrasting Gal. 2:16 with Rom. 2:13:
"[F]or not the hearers of the Law are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified." (Rom. 2:13)
Then, as always, Martin Luther's "book of straw" poses its own wrinkle on the subject of justification:
"You see that a man is justified by works, and not by faith alone" (James 2:24).
This contrast seems to be a blatant contradiction, but is not when the context of James' statement more carefully scrutinized. First, if we have not works, we did not really have any faith to begin with. "[F]aith without works is dead" (James 2:26). Thus, if we do not obey God, we are not justified because we would have shown we never truly repented (which always must involve the determination to obey God in the future). For if we truly repent, we will begin to obey God because we have an overall obedient attitude (Acts 26:20), even if we may continue to sin now and then. Thus, when James says (v. 21), "was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he offered up Isaac his son on the altar," he means that Abraham showed he had an overall obedient attitude (the proof of true repentance) by doing a literal work of righteousness. Through this repentant attitude, Abraham fulfilled one of the conditions for being justified (Acts 5:31; Luke 24:47; compare II Cor. 7:10; Acts 13:24). So now we know justification comes only from faith ultimately.
Also, in resolving the seeming contradiction between James and Paul concerning justification, we need to realize "justification" and "sanctification" have secondary meanings to those found in the three-definition schema of salvation described above. Since we humans keep sinning all the time, including after we have confessed our sins to God and accepted Jesus as our personal Savior at some definite point in the past, we continually need to keep getting justified as we keep sinning. But, contrary to what those who accept "once saved, always saved" maintain, justification should not be seen as a one-time event that forgives in advance all the sins we will commit in the future. This view can turn God's grace into a license for sin, since no matter how much we may sin, it is automatically already forgiven at the moment we initially accepted Jesus as our personal Savior. As for sanctification, in one sense we are "sanctified" (made holy) all at once, which is when we receive the Spirit of God after baptism and the laying on of hands (Acts 8:14-19; 19:6). But becoming obedient in the habits of daily living is a gradual, life-long process, so sanctification should be mainly seen as a process rather than something instantaneous (Rom. 6:13, 16, 19, 22; I John 3:7).
Hence, one solution to the seeming contradiction between Paul and James on justification is to see the former as normally talking about the initial moment of conversion, while the latter discusses how it needs to be maintained by a continuously repentant and faithful relationship with God.
Now--what is the relationship between righteousness and faith? Since justification literally means "to be declared righteous," it is obvious that righteousness must also be gained by faith, just like justification (the removing of sin) is. The Bible shows that two types of righteousness come from God, since that word is used two different ways. The first type of righteousness is imputed, meaning it is attributed to us by God due to our faith only (Rom. 10:10). We find this type in Rom. 4:6:
"[J]ust as David also speaks of the blessing upon the man to whom God reckons righteousness apart from works."
The second type of righteousness--imparted righteousness--is gradually gained as spiritual character is developed through using the Holy Spirit to overcome through various trials (Phil. 3:12-13). This type is described in Rom. 6:16:
"[Y]ou are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?"
This second type is actual righteousness, composed of acquired habits of obedience, and is not something God just arbitrarily asserts we have. Imputed righteousness corresponds with justification's normal definition, while imparted righteousness corresponds with sanctification.
A Christian receives imputed righteousness when he places his faith in Jesus' sacrifice. As Paul put it in Romans 4:5:
"But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned [regarded] as righteousness."
Or, as the Old Testament put it (Gen. 15:6):
"Then he [Abraham] believed in the Eternal, and He reckoned it to him as righteousness."
When imputed righteousness is given to a Christian, he has still has to overcome all his old evil habits from his life prior to repentance. Likewise, Abraham, in Rom. 4:10-11 was declared righteous before he was circumcised:
"How then was it reckoned? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised; and he received the sign of circumcision [not the actual reality--it was only imputed spiritually], a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while uncircumcised, that righteousness might be reckoned [to be looked upon as having] to them . . ."
Notice also Rom. 4:22 (KJV): "And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness." Then Phil. 3:9 says: .
"[A]nd may be found in Him, not having a righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith [only--without works] may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law [i.e. from coming under the Old Covenant by being circumcised], but what which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith [without the physical act--"work"--of being circumcised]."
Thus, there is one kind of righteousness which is attributed (imputed) to us purely on the basis of faith, without having overcome any evil habits we may have, or obeying various physical rituals (such as circumcision) found in the Old Testament
Imparted righteousness--the "second" type of righteousness--is gradually developed as a Christian progresses in his spiritual life as he overcomes sins with the Holy Spirit's help (Rom. 8:13). For God does not just intend to only say (declare) that we are righteousness by removing our sins from us (which constitutes imputed righteousness), but He wants us to actually become righteous by overcoming sinful ways of life. Note Rom. 8:3-4:
"He condemned sin in the flesh, in order that the requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit."
We are to become holy (sanctified): "Be holy, for I am holy" (Lev. 11:44).
We must never think, as many professing Christians do, that we are not to work hard to actually become righteous, since they think being declared righteous is enough with an initial conversion experience which they might call "being born again." They want imputed righteousness without striving to actually become righteous by obeying the law, which is imparted righteousness. To the contrary, we must put effort into becoming sanctified (holy):
"[D]o not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present your selves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members of instruments of righteousness" (Rom. 6:13).
"[Y]ou are the slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness" (Rom. 6:16).
Then, what does righteousness result in?
"[S]o now present you members as slaves to righteousness, resulting in sanctification" (Rom. 6:19).
Then, what does sanctification result in?
"But now having been freed from sin and enslaved to God, you derive your benefit, resulting in sanctification, and the outcome, eternal life" (Rom. 6:22).
Observe how imparted righteousness is linked sanctification, and in turn how sanctification is made a condition to salvation! Thus, at first we are declared righteous because Jesus took away our sins, but later we are actually to become righteous by overcoming sinful habits with God's help.
In order to become truly righteous, we need more than just our faith IN Jesus, which only allows us to be declared righteous (justified). Instead, we need also to have to actual faith OF Jesus, not just IN Jesus, since we must have God's help in order to become truly obedient in all the habits of our life. "For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith, as it is written, 'But the righteous man shall live by faith'" (Rom. 1:17). To have the death penalty removed from us by being justified does not make our old sinful habits go away automatically. We must have God's help to overcome our carnal ways of life, through the faith OF Christ. Since Jesus needed God's help in order to resist sin (Heb. 5:7), then surely we do also (Rom. 8:13). We are to learn how to live a righteous life by Jesus' own faith coming into us, becoming a part of us:
"I am crucified with Christ; nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith OF the Son of God" (Gal. 2:20, KJV).
We could never become actually righteous by our own efforts alone: "And all our righteous deeds are like a filthy garment" (Isa. 64:6).
One stumbling block to various professing Christians attempting to become actually righteous is the common belief that the law is done away such that there is no need to obey God. But this confuses the law as a guide to conduct with the law as a source of salvation. Christians should look to the law as if it was a mirror helping reveal what is wrong in their lives (James 2:23-25):
"For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man who looks at his natural face in a mirror; for once he has looked at himself and gone away, he has immediately forgotten what kind of person he was. But the one who looks intently at the perfect law, the law of liberty, and abides by it, not having become a forgetful hearer but an effectual doer, this man shall be blessed in what he does."
The law defines what is righteousness since sin occurs when it is disobeyed.
"Sin is the transgression of the law" (I John 3:4, KJV).
"Sin is not imputed when there is no law" (Rom. 5:13).
"Shall we say, then, that the Law itself is sinful? Of course not! But it was the Law that made me know what sin is. If the Law had not said, 'Do not desire what belongs to someone else,' I would not have know such a desire [was sin] "(Rom. 7:7).
"Through the law comes the knowledge of sin" (Rom. 3:20).
The law convicts us since when we disobey it, it condemns us (Rom. 4:15):
"[F]or the Law brings about wrath." "[F]or sin, taking opportunity through the commandment deceived me, and through it killed me" (Rom. 7:11).
Obviously, that which is the source of condemnation cannot be a source of salvation! Yet, the law is still a Christian's compass as to what God wants us to do in our lives.
Furthermore, the law is clearly still in force:
"Do we nullify the law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the law" (Rom. 3:31).
"For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all. For he who said, 'Do not commit adultery,' also said, 'Do not commit murder.' Now if you do not commit adultery, but do commit murder, you have become a transgressor of the law" (James 2:10-11).
Obviously, you cannot transgress what has been abolished!
"For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man . . . " (Rom. 7:22).
How could Paul "joyfully concur" with something that has been abolished? He certainly did not in Galatians! In Eph. 6:1-3, he says the Fifth Commandment is still in force. Of course, some aspects of the law have been abolished (Eph. 2:15; Heb. 9:10; 10:8-9). But the moral law, which is codified by the Ten Commandments, MUST STILL BE IN FORCE, or else the Bible contradicts itself. Thus, the dual law theory is true.
The law does not contradict grace so long as we realize specifically how each has a different role. The law is the great sin detector--it tells us what to do and not do. Grace describes the attitude God has towards mankind's sins: He forgives us through unmerited pardon. Obedience does not earn salvation, since only by grace, not by the merit of lawkeeping, is salvation ultimately saved. Without Jesus' death on behalf of our sins, nobody could be saved. But if one routinely sins without repentance or an overall obedient attitude, one will lose salvation. Lawkeeping earns nothing concerning salvation, but lawbreaking without repentance costs salvation since "the wages of sin is death" (Rom. 6:23) before and after baptism. However, so long as one has an overall obedient attitude, which will inevitably manifest itself in works, one will still be saved. So long as a Christian has the Holy Spirit, which is the presence of salvation conditionally, he or she will still be saved (II Cor. 5:5; Eph. 4:30; 1:13-14).
But how do we explain about being saved by grace when we encounter such scriptures as Matt. 16:27 (KJV):
"For the Son of Man shall come in the glory of His Father with His angels; and then He shall reward every man according to his works."
Or Rev. 20:12:
"[T]he dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds" ?
What we need to realize here is that our "reward" is not salvation, but rather how high or low a position we will have in the kingdom of God. The parable of the pounds (Luke 19:11-27), which has servants receiving positions of rule over ten (v. 17) and five (v. 19) cities, plainly shows different ranks will exist in the kingdom of God. The servants were rewarded due to their differing efforts, differing positions, relative to their ability (Matt. 25:14). Obviously, getting into the kingdom of God is not based on ability or what is earned, but with whether you repent, have faith in Jesus' sacrifice, and accept God's grace. [True, such faith must manifest works to be real (James 2:26)]. A reward is something given in exchange for some service, good work, achievement, or accomplishment, such as being put on the honor roll at school in exchange for having good grades, while grace is something given completely freely, in exchange for nothing, and is totally undeserved. Thus grace is the opposite of a reward, and since eternal life is a gift (Rom. 6:23), it can NEVER be a reward in exchange for services (works) rendered.
Since getting into the kingdom of God is by grace, the amount of time you are a Christian in the process of sanctification has nothing to do with whether you are saved (Matt. 20:1-16). Instead, the issue is, Have you repented, Did you have faith in God's grace, and Did you receive the Holy Spirit, which is what makes you a Christian (Rom. 8:9)?
For if you die the day after having gained the Holy Spirit through the laying on of hands, you are every bit as much saved as if you were a Christian for fifty years and then died. For instance, those who repent and believe during the Great Tribulation will be saved despite having only believed for a brief period before being martyred in it. But the person who is a Christian for fifty years before dying has a chance to gain a higher position in the kingdom of God if he works hard to overcome his past bad and sinful ways. Thus, besides the benefits of being happier in this life due to obeying God's law lifelong, there also can be a great spiritual benefit (rank in the kingdom of God), even though everyone receives by grace the same basic benefit and gift: eternal life (Matt. 20:12-16).
Are Christians qualifying for the kingdom of God now? The answer is yes or no, depending on the definition of the word "qualify" used. If "qualify" is taken to mean "to be fitted or competent for something," the answer is no, because Christians on their own will never be fit enough or competent enough for God's kingdom. On the other hand, if the word "qualify" is taken to mean "to get authority, license, power etc. (i.e. something) as by fulfilling required conditions," then the answers is yes. If Christians fulfill the required conditions of repentance and faith, they will enter the kingdom of God due to God's grace. Thus Christians either are or aren't qualifying for the kingdom of God, depending on how the word "qualify" is used.
A key point in reconciling grace and works is that an obedient attitude is a condition to salvation.
Grace is undeserved and unmerited, but it is not unconditional. As someone once pointed out, "We have to be eligible for grace." God lays down certain requirements for anyone who wishes to receive salvation: Repentance and faith in Jesus' sacrifice, which must be expressed by baptism (Acts 2:38, John 3:5; Mark 16:16).
Repentance literally means "a change of mind" or "having another mind." And since repentance involves not only the confessions of sins to God, but also the will to try to obey God in the future, you must have an overall obedient attitude if you wish to be saved. Naturally, if you have this obedient, repentant attitude, you will produce good works matching it. For a faith that produces no works cannot save:
"You believe that God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder" (James 2:19).
Those who truly repent, are baptized, and then receive the gift of the Holy Spirit will strive to obey God. The Holy Spirit is not passive within you, but it will flow out in righteous works if you allow it to. The branches (Christians) will produce fruit (righteous works) if you allow the Holy Spirit to work within you (John 15:1-8). Thus, if one is repentant, one had better be trying to obey God, or else one's "repentance" or "faith" were delusions. Occasional slip-ups can be expected, and are routinely forgiven ("justified"), but they should decrease as one grows spiritually (II Pet. 3:18). Those who strive to gain more of the same faith Jesus had, the faith OF Christ, will establish the law (Rom. 3:31) in their lives, and avoid sinning as much as possible. Of course, our sins can always be forgiven even after baptism (I John 1:8), but may we minimize them! Repentance without works is just as dead as faith is without works.
Notice that the fact God has conditions to his grace does not mean we earn salvation by fulfilling those conditions. Rather, through repentance and faith, we are doing only what was required of us already (Luke 17:10). No amount of lawkeeping today can take away a single sin committed yesterday. Only through Jesus' sacrifice, and not through commandment keeping, can any sin be forgiven. And surely no one has "earned" the right to have Jesus' innocent life slain for himself or herself! Consider: If God had no conditions to salvation, then anybody could demand the benefits of God's grace, which is eternal life. It would become a right. Even a criminal who never repented or believed in Jesus' sacrifice could whine to God, "I want eternal life and forgiveness now!," and God would have to give it to him if He imposed no conditions. On the contrary, notice Gal. 5:21 and I Cor. 6:9-11. We must have an obedient, repentant attitude if we wish to be saved. Only by laying down conditions can God keep His impartial grace from being abused.
In a very important sense, we can always be confident of our salvation so long as we have an overall repentant and obedient attitude, which will be a manifestation of our faith. Literal obedience will then be a natural outflow of our faith and obedient attitude. If we sin, now and then, we can always be forgiven so long as we repent and strive to keep that overall obedient attitude. Occasionally, of course, we have bad attitudes, especially when under stress, but so long as we repent of these mental slips there is no danger to our salvation since our overall attitude would still be correct, and we still would have the Holy Spirit, which is what guarantees eternal life so long as it is within us (Rom. 8:11; II Cor. 5:5). Those who worry about having committed the unpardonable sin almost certainly have not committed it, if they still wish to repent. Let us never give up being a Christian because we sin occasionally, for with God's help and forgiveness we will triumph:
"If God is for us, who is against us?" (Rom. 8:31).
Tue Oct 31, 05:58:00 AM
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